Making genuine connections is critical to building your business, and today, we're talking with a master connector.
I've known Mark McIntosh for about a year, and we finally got a chance to sit down and talk about leveraging LinkedIn for lead generation.
He runs an agency that helps business owners and professionals build their networks. He has helped people from all sorts of industries, including me! I've experienced his approach and the power of an orchestrated approach.
We discuss the benefits of building genuine connections by adding value and fostering trust and ways to position yourself as a thought leader without using spammy tactics.
Mark also shares practical strategies for warm connections, re-engaging people, and using mutual connections. These are all ideas he has detailed in his new book 'Attracting High-Value Clients', making it a valuable resource for anyone looking to enhance their networking skills.
This podcast is a great opportunity to delve into the world of network building and, of course, to understand your book's pivotal role in this value-driven approach.
SHOW HIGHLIGHTS
- Mark McIntosh and I discuss the importance of generating leads on LinkedIn by adding value and building trust rather than using spammy tactics.
- We emphasize the significance of a multi-channel approach that includes LinkedIn, email outreach, and phone calls to maintain a consistent pipeline.
- Mark shares insights on the effectiveness of warm and tepid introductions, re-engaging existing networks, and leveraging mutual connections for outreach.
- We address the challenges businesses face with traditional growth methods like word-of-mouth and networking, and how a systematic approach can offer predictability and consistency.
- Our discussion highlights the transformation of LinkedIn profiles from passive resumes to active lead generation tools through compelling content strategies.
- Mark elaborates on how businesses can position themselves as thought leaders by integrating books into their LinkedIn strategies, enhancing credibility and initiating meaningful conversations.
- We explore the concept of attracting high-value clients rather than aggressively chasing them, and how books can be an effective tool in this strategy.
- We touch on the importance of using a multi-channel approach, combining LinkedIn tactics with inbound and outbound strategies, referrals, and direct outreach for comprehensive client attraction.
- Mark and I reflect on the collaborative nature of our services, emphasizing the benefits of working together to maintain consistent outreach while clients focus on their core strengths.
- We conclude with a heartfelt conversation about the journey of our discussions, expressing gratitude for the insightful dialogue and support from the audience.
Show notes & video: 90minutebooks.com/podcast/170
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Mark McIntosh:
Website: Revgrow |
LinkedIn: Mark McIntosh
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TRANSCRIPT
(AI transcript provided as supporting material and may contain errors)
Stuart: Hey everyone, welcome back to another episode of the Bookmore Show. It's Stuart Bell here, and today joined by Mark McIntosh. Mark, how are you doing, buddy? Good? Good morning Stuart. How are you Good? Thank you, good to see you again. Yeah, you too. It's always interesting. The show is because half of the people I talk to I know and half the people I don't know. I was chatting with someone last week who I'd seen go through the process. It was a client who had been through the process but we'd never got a chance to speak, whereas you and I know each other more. So it gives just an interesting dynamic. I always feel like sometimes it's a bit more of a with new people, but with people I know you can kind of jump to the chase a little bit more, but with people I know can kind of jump to the chase a little bit more. So to get everyone else up to speed, why don't you start with a bit of an introduction about you and what the company does?
Mark: I'm Mark McIntosh and I'm in the Dallas-Fort Worth area and we help our clients grow by filling their pipeline, keeping it consistently full throughout the year, and the way we do it is through a multi-channel approach that leverages LinkedIn, both outbound and inbound strategies, including content marketing. We also do email outreach and phone calls for our clients, and so, yeah, we're an outsourced lead generation agency and our primary method of doing this is through LinkedIn, and we also have discovered over the last year or two that leveraging email and a phone call in a multi-channel approach has been very effective. And another thing we do, which you know, stuart, is a lot of warm introductions and strategic introductions that you know somebody might not be open to a call from a cold outreach, so what we'll do is help them gain access to their prospects by leveraging mutual connections. So that's a strategy that we deploy that has worked really well.
Stuart: And that, I think, is one of the interesting approaches, because I mean, particularly in the last year, 50% of the emails in my inbox must be either people reaching out cold or agencies saying, hey, we can do it, can you take 10 more clients this month? Or we were working with someone in your area and we can fill leads for you. But what I mean I guess the connection that we had in the first place was a mutual connection through someone else, so that immediately warms up the relationship. But we've been working together for a number of months now and the this is a little bit anecdotal, but I think the most effective element of everything that we've been doing is that warm connection, and I think not only warm in the sense of not introducing to a very close friend or contact, but just warm where there's some kind of connection. There already there's some kind of anchor to hang it on.
It's not completely cold, so that is that we see with other clients as well, that kind of mix between, if I think about very warm it's someone who I know personally and genuinely know, for want of a better term and then there's kind of like a tepid introduction which is there's some connection there, and then there's just of like a tepid introduction which is there's some connection there, and then there's just the cold outreach stuff. So do you find that with other clients as well, that the warm, slash, tepid stuff is more effective? Yeah.
Mark: Yeah. So for example, during the first few months of a campaign for our clients, we like to look at their existing network and help them re-engage with those folks who might be good referral partners for them or prospects. And most of our clients they've connected with people, they've done a good job building their network but they've just lost touch or they've gotten busy. So for many of our clients there's a ton of gold in their existing network. So when we re-engage with those folks it's a warmer outreach because there's presumably some of that no like and trust and at least some familiarity because they're already existing connections, existing connections. And then to your point, when we make strategic introductions, or if our clients get with referral buddies and they make introductions to people they're connected to, that might be your second degree. Again, it's that familiarity and that just a warmer familiarity and that just a warmer, softer approach than just getting a cold message where they might not know you from Adam.
So for most of our clients the results from those two strategies is very, very positive. Now, the degree at which you know the volume of warm introductions and the volume of folks that we can re-engage with. There's a lot of factors that might influence that the size of their existing network and how well they've done building their network over the years. But those two strategies far and away have been our most effective across the board.
Stuart: I think that's a great point as well. It's almost the if you could sit and have that perfect, that perfect setup to engaging with people, if you knew you had all the time in the world to engage, versus the actual time that you've gotten, the effort that you've got to do it on your own, on your own behalf, working with someone else or having someone else taking on that responsibility to do some of the I don't even necessarily want to call it legwork, but the the work that you would do if you didn't have any other constraints. I think a lot of people are in the position where they would like to do this anyway, it's just they don't have time. I really resonate with that bit of forgetting about it.
Mark: That is the reason we exist, stuart. So a lot of our clients they're small businesses, entrepreneurs, ceo, founder that's wearing many hats and they're not quite big enough often to have an in-house marketing team or a sales team or a group of lead generation specialists and they want to spend time in their superpower doing what they love to do and what they do best. So for most of our clients, they may do the lead generation and the prospecting and the LinkedIn activities sporadically or just maybe for a couple of weeks, and then they get busy something else. So the done for you aspect, you know whether you outsource it to someone or you delegate it to someone.
That is why we exist, because our clients are bright. They can do a lot of what we do. They just won't because it's not their cup of tea, they don't like to do it. Maybe they haven't taken the time to understand all the nuances and the strategies, and so that's where we come in. We'll do it for them and you know that's our crowd is really the done for you crowd versus the do it yourself, and it really comes down to time and energy and them wanting to focus on what they do best and more strategic matters and serving their existing clients that's actually such a sweet spot with the people who we work with too.
Stuart: It's again it's not rocket science what we do, but the likelihood of someone doing it by themselves is so slim. It's being able to do it for them and someone adding their unique ability and their ideas and the stuff that is key to what they do, but us being able to take the heavy lift of the rest of it. Similar to the way that you guys work For you guys. Is there any particular group of people who you work best with?
Mark: Any particular types of clients. All of our clients are in the B2B business to business, and often they're selling a service or a solution. So they might be selling books. They're done for books, like you guys are done for podcasting or a lot of consulting firms will hire us, other marketing agencies hire us accounting staffing, a lot of technology solutions, and so, yeah, it's all B2B. Our clients they're usually smaller, like I mentioned before, where you know, maybe they're you know, a couple hundred thousand a year up to about five or seven million a year and they just need the expertise and the resources to do it for them and we're a cost effective solution for that.
Clients all over the nation and in fact we have one in South America I'm talking to a guy from Europe tomorrow, so really no boundaries geographically, but they're across the board. They're really good at what they do. They're excellent. Once they get in front of people, they just need more at they do they're excellent once they get in front of people, they just need more at-bats. And they have historically gotten most of their business through word of mouth, networking, referrals, but it's just not enough. So maybe that gets them to 80% of their goal. Maybe that gets them to 80% of their goal. But those methods are unpredictable and often insufficient. So how do they bridge that delta? How did they get to their ultimate growth goal? And it's by hiring us and getting more of a systematic, consistent, more intentional approach in place so they never have to worry about their pipeline or where that next client will be. So really adding consistency, predictability and intentionality and doing it consistently.
Stuart: And again, it's just a peace of mind and we're doing that on their behalf why they're focused on moving their business forward like you say, it's that real balance of being able to focus on the stuff that you do well and the stuff that you would like to do, if you remember to do it, allowing someone else to do that in a kind of collaborative approach, because I think it's so much more beneficial, having worked as I say now for approach, because I think it's so much more beneficial, having worked, as I say now, for a good couple of months it's so much more beneficial than just kind of the traditional idea of outsourcing that you think about, where the whole task and responsibility is shifted somewhere else, to be able to work collaboratively with one of the guys on the team. So that it is your message. It's literally the having a partner to bounce ideas off and strategize with, but then someone delivering your words in the way that you would deliver them if you trust them. So there's no kind of like separation. There's no kind of generic stuff, it's no kind of AI farm stuff just going out. It really is your message.
If you could, you mentioned this. We were talking about the strategies and, depending on how big your audience was to begin with, it would be. There's a couple of different options If someone really hasn't thought to use LinkedIn in the past or any LinkedIn works that they've done really has just been reactive and maybe just accepting some responses rather than orchestrating it. Is that still an option for people, or do they have to have done something already? Can you take people who are almost starting from scratch?
Mark: We, you know, ideally they would have had, you know, at least their first 500 connections on LinkedIn and have seen some success. So we don't have to convince them that, hey, linkedin is a goldmine. But we can certainly. I just worked with a friend of mine last week and he was virtually starting from scratch. So a lot of what we did during the first month was get his connections of targeted prospects and influencers and customers and vendors and existing connections, get that up to that 500 plus mark on LinkedIn. And so, yeah, we started from scratch.
He had a very basic, simple LinkedIn profile. That was really it wasn't compelling. That was really it wasn't compelling. It was just very basic, more like a resume. So we completely revamped everything his profile to really make it pop and shine, you know, clear, concise, compelling, client-centric and also complete. So, yeah, we work with people that are just getting started, all the way up to those that have. Some of our clients have 20,000 connections and they've done a pretty good job over the years building their network and their connections, but they've never actually engaged in a manner to monetize orchestration network right?
Stuart: yes, yeah, that idea of people using it as a resume. I've been around long enough to remember when linkedin launched and was using it in a resume. I've been around long enough to remember when linkedin launched and was using it in a corporate career and it was exactly that there was very little content around, it was all work-based experience and using it for the next role clients are you working with. Have they kind of switched now a lot to more of the? It's a content creation platform and an opportunity for lead generation, so you'd have to do less of that convincing that people should put more effort into it, or a lot of people who have that first interaction. We're still thinking of it as a resume platform yeah, that's a great question.
Mark: Every client is different. So some of our clients they understand marketing and most of them do they understand the importance of content. They understand marketing and most of them do they understand the importance of content. They understand the importance of prospecting and keeping their pipeline full and they understand because they've done websites for their company etc the importance of having a customer-centric resource and sharing value with their network. So majority of our clients get that and they've seen success, but they're just not doing it consistently. Or maybe they're doing it but they really don't know the best methods and they haven't put much strategy into the types of content they're posting and the frequency of content and how to lay out a piece of content with keywords and hashtags and things like that. So most of our clients I don't need to convince them that LinkedIn is a gold mine and all of their prospects have a presence on LinkedIn- Actively there.
Stuart: It's such an interesting space because it's so professional, in the sense of it's not like the other social media platforms that the hyperbole and the vitriol and the combative nature is, and it's such a supportive environment. It's so friendly. And then people are there for the purpose of developing professional networks, whether it's careers or business. But it's such a nicer place to be and I think that adding in the technical details or the tactical details and then helping people with the strategy is really quite a big difference in what you guys provide, the. You talk about the couple of stages of it. So one is the profile, making sure that the profile is aligned with the outcome that you want, and then another piece around outreach and another piece around content, kind of like the engagement.
I'm going to kind of bridge it into books a little bit and then talk about your book as well. We're using our book in our funnel as an outreach piece. So this idea of making a connection and then delivering something of value, we're using the book, obviously the scorecard book that I wrote, because it's such an easy introduction to the conversation and it's relevant to what we do. Do many people use that first step of delivering value? Are many of the existing clients using books, or are they using other pieces of content that they've got around?
Mark: Great Our approach and the best way to leverage LinkedIn is not the pitch slap or the connect and pitch.
It's all about adding value which creates that know, like and trust and also positions you as the thought leader out there in your space, but also as one of the good guys. So we're all getting spammed and pitch slapped every single day and it's not good. So our clients will always have something of value. It may be a book, it may be a podcast, it may be a blog post, an article, a poll, research, white paper, something, and we always encourage our clients more or less give your best stuff away. You know whether that's a book or a free chapter of a book, or you know a compelling case study or a white paper or something. But your audience, they care about what's in it for them and if you can educate them and share a point of view that resonates with them, pique that interest and that curiosity, and then also, by laying out these value bombs throughout the relationship, it really helps set you apart from the crowd and the people that aren't going about it in a value, trust-based approach.
Stuart: Right, it's such a difference. I mean, even I see it not so much on LinkedIn or on email, maybe, but people just leading straight away with something that they obviously want, even if they're couching it slightly in terms of providing value. But it's very rare that people are just delivering something of use. There's always that pretty obvious veil of value, but then asking straight away. So to have that strategy where there is a little bit more of a relationship building, knowing that there's a few touch points in it, rather than just going straight for the, straight for the oh, here's how I can provide value. It's much more. It starts the relationship off in a much easier and better way, which I guess actually brings us to your book.
So the idea that you were writing about the, the, the attracting people, the attracting people, the attracting high value clients that word attracting, it's very kind of magnetic and drawing towards rather than chasing or hunting down or trapping high value clients what was the thinking behind? What was the thinking behind bringing things together in this particular way? Obviously, you know the subject. You've got a lot of things that you could talk about. What was the thinking behind picking these particular elements to include in the book?
Mark: Yeah, I mean attracting high value clients. One of my guys I know he calls them right fit clients, high value clients. That's the goal. So we're all looking to find those clients that we know are a good fit for us and vice versa. So, by using the word attracting, that encompasses a lot of different ways to do that Inbound, outbound, referrals, warm introductions, email follow-ups, phone calls, LinkedIn strategies.
So I've always wanted to write a book. I just it was too overwhelming to even think about the process, and so, connecting with you as we got introduced by David, it was a godsend because I didn't realize it could be this easy to do and it was just such a relief to know that you guys had the process and the value and the pricing options and things that just made it much more easier and more efficient and smoother than I ever thought was possible. And that's like. I don't know if that answered your question about attracting high value clients, but a book is a great way and we do that on LinkedIn, where we position our clients as a thought leader, as an expert in their space, and that's a great way to attract high value clients. And a book I can't think of a better way than a book to really elevate yourself as a thought leader in the space. And what a great way to share everything we've learned along our journey and the valuable insights, and to do it in a friendly, useful manner than your books that you did.
Stuart: So that's why I was saying to someone yesterday this idea that anyone who's been in business for more than a year, you've got all of the knowledge in your head and the experience and your particular way of doing it to really add that value and attract the audience and lead with a given hand and start the conversation in a meaningful way rather than just go in. I love the term pitch, slap. It's so. It just happens far too often. There's so much more of a meaningful way that just gets your ideas out there and whether or not, I think people get hung up on the idea that they need to write a bestseller or a completely unique idea or it needs to be competing on Amazon's shelves against the kind of brightest and the best, but for most of us that's not, in fact, almost all of us. That's not where we're using it. We're using it to try and engage one person in a conversation.
That kind of leads to a next step, the process that you were talking about making it as easy and straightforward as possible. That's what I like about your guys service as well is I know what I would want to do if I had the belief that I would actually remember to do it consistently, but I'm not going to do it so to be able to, we help extract people's knowledge and get it into a book and you guys help extract people's knowledge and get it into a consistent linkedin strategy and those two things. There's such a synergy between the two the idea of writing the book and bringing it together, of starting the conversation with the people who you want to start the conversation with. I often ask people because this idea of kind of like beneficial constraints we've been in business long enough that we could write books and books and books worth of stuff. We've got that much knowledge in our heads. Was it an easy decision to what to include and what to leave for a later conversation?
Mark: For me it was easy because I had done e-books in the past. I've done a lot of presentations, so the framework or the outline of what I wanted to share and expand upon in a book format. That was easy because I had already configured that over the last several years. The fact that you and I you know one I didn't have the awareness of your solution and there were companies like yours that I mean just offer exactly what I needed for my purpose and my budget and my timeline. It was just a perfect fit.
Stuart: So I was scrolling through Instagram over the last week or two.
I must have clicked on a couple of the competitors and because I've clicked on a couple of things, then obviously the feed is just full of similar stuff.
So the number of we've been around now for 10 years.
So the number of competitors now are a lot more of time and the budget is so much more aligned with this idea of a campaign conversation starting book compared with, I think, a number of other people come to the project from a publishing world and everything is then just elevated to a level that's that's much higher than is is really what's fit for purpose in in this context.
So that's why I like the ability to kind of marry up the person's intent, the amount of time they've got, the use case and everything that kind of makes it an effective way of starting the conversation, either on LinkedIn or through email or through referrals. And again, that's why the two services align so well. So you've got the book now created, you've got all of the LinkedIn strategy and the ways that you guys work across the board. What thoughts have you got around how to use the book tied in with your own LinkedIn strategy, kind of trying to x-ray spec or shortcut for people listening in what you, as a LinkedIn expert, would do if you had a book. So, therefore, what they could do now that they've got a book.
Mark: Yeah, for one. A link to the book is on my profile so it's instant credibility. And I talked to a guy yesterday, before our call, he had already went out and purchased the book, so it just really made a big difference on that initial call. So that's one way we use it. Another way we use it as you know, each chapter and each there's several posts that we can create on LinkedIn, leveraging the content and repurposing the content that's already in the book. So that's been another way we've used it.
I'm currently in the process of updating our website where somebody can opt in to receive a copy of our book, the electronic version, and you know it's a freebie.
It's a huge value add and just by reading the book they're going to have everything that we do for our clients and be able to grow their business if they're willing to take the time to implement some of the strategies laid out in the book laid out in the book.
So having it as a lead magnet or a useful resource that they can acquire just by visiting our website is another way that we're using it. And then if somebody gets referred in and I want to send them a copy of the book, either electronically or a hard copy copy of the book, either electronically or a hard copy. That's another way that we'll use the book. And then the final way well, there's a couple others, but one to get on podcast, to get speaking gigs. Another one would be for our referral partners and as a value add or a gift for them all partners and as a value add or a gift for them. So there's a ton of ideas that we plan to utilize and get an ROI from this book, which may be the first book of many, because I've enjoyed this process so much.
Stuart: That's what I'd love about working with guys like you who have kind of the framework or the structure or the idea of how to use it is there and you can see the roadmap ahead. So it's always one of the more disheartening things is when you kind of check back in with people a year later and they've kind of finished the project but it's kind of fallen by the wayside and I haven't actually got around to using it that much. Much nicer like, creating the book is kind of like the first step. It's the it's. It's setting up the profile, the linkedin profile. It's the it's a foundational first step, but it's only the first step. It's the fact that it exists isn't going to do that much, but getting out there and using it. I really like the idea and again talk to people about this a lot.
The idea of the book now becomes the tentpole around which other content is created and refers back. So they're creating posts that refer to content that's in the book. Then when people see the book they're not hearing it for the first time. It's reinforcing and building on the message that you've kind of putting out there across many different ways and the fact that people are joining calls, discovery calls or initial calls with you and they've had some exposure to the book already. Again, the things that you're saying, they're not hearing it for the first time. What you're saying is reinforcing things that they've already read. They just read it in your book. So the synergies that can come from it, the kind of multi-channel uses of having done the work to create it yeah, it really does build this kind of army of assets out there that you can just get in front of the people at the right time and move them to the next step bring awareness, you know, to draw interest, to help reinforce your solution, to help seal the deal and ultimately win the client.
Mark: So it's throughout the funnel and there's a multitude of ways we can leverage the book. And another idea is for referral partners or people that also serve your ideal customer. I'll send them two or three books that they can give out to people, and they're the hero in that situation. What a great way for them to add value for their clients is to give them somebody else's book. Now, that's another way we're using that as well.
Stuart: That's a psychology of why people refer, the idea that people refer because they're happy to there's the baseline of them being happy to refer, but there's also this element of social capital within the group of of them wanting to refer something because it gives them a higher status in the nicest possible sense, but for a non-competing business. So CPA or accountants that works with other B2B clients, to be able to hear them talking about excuse me, hear them talking about someone having a LinkedIn challenge and they say, oh, that's okay, I've got you covered, I know the guy. And then here let me give you a copy of the book and kind of present it across.
Mark: yeah, such a fantastic idea since them as a a good guy and a thought later and a problem solver. So they're not just looking after their best interest, that they recognize the prospect is having challenges in other areas. You know what a great way for that cpa to stand out from the crowd and position themselves as a true, trusted advisor, as opposed to somebody that's trying to just sell them on their cpa services. So that's a great point.
Stuart: Yeah, that collaborative kind of approach to the greater good, because they've got no skin in the game. They're offering the LinkedIn book to one of their CPA clients purely as a greater good type option to improving their service and, as you say say, being that trusted partner. It's that's why I get excited and passionate about it. The more people kind of get this created into something that can be out there in the world making a difference, the more likelihood it is that it will make a difference to someone, and those differences only need to be small. But the world is a better place for having them out there than than not.
Time always goes fast on these shows. I really appreciate it. It'd be great to circle back in a couple of months actually and give people an update and then maybe talk about some more strategies. But in the meantime I want to make sure that people can get access to you and and what rev grow do. So where's a good place for people to head over to if they want to learn more about kind of utilizing and making the most of LinkedIn for themselves? Yeah, great question.
Mark: Appreciate that. Yeah, just visit my LinkedIn profile. So just type in Mark McIntosh, revgrow. That's one way. Another way is to email me at [email protected], or they can visit our website, which is RevGrow.com.
Stuart: Fantastic. As always, I'll make sure I put links in the show notes so, whether people are listening on a podcast player or they've gone to the website, there'll be links directly through there so that people can see what's going on. And on LinkedIn, I mean the connections that you make with people. Everyone listening to this show is kind of loosely connected in our world. So even making a connection there, this whole kind of referral opportunity of connecting like-minded people and being the go-to person for someone else, it's expanding that network. You never know where that goes down the track. And and of course, there's a copy of the book available there as well. So people should definitely follow, follow the links and grab that copy because, as you said before, even if people just read it and try and implement some of the things themselves, there's still a lot of gems in there to to make improvements until the point that they're ready to to get a partner to do it with them.
Mark: For sure.
Stuart: it's been a pleasure. Buddy, it's as I say, it always goes too fast. It'd be really good to circle back in a in a little while and see how things are going, but in the meantime I just want to say thanks again for your time and everyone, Thanks for tuning in and then we'll catch you all in the next one. Thanks, Stuart, and thank you.